CDC Does Not Change COVID-19 Mask Guidance

Speaker 1: 00:00 Hand washing and disinfecting services are always good ideas. But research now shows that COVID-19 is spread primarily through the air. That's the message from a group of prominent researchers who were urging the CDC to update its COVID prevention guidelines, they say more attention should be paid to better masks and air filters to reduce the spread of tiny particles in exhaled air that are responsible for the majority of COVID-19 infections. The researchers have written a letter with their recommendations to the Biden administration. And one of the co-signers is UC San Diego atmospheric chemist, Kim, pray there, and she joins us. Now, Kim, welcome to the show. Speaker 2: 00:42 Thank you. Thanks for having me. How Speaker 1: 00:44 Do we know that most infections are spread by airborne particles? Speaker 2: 00:50 Cause basically, you know, in the measurements, science is pointing in this direction when, uh, you know, the measurements, people are just detecting them in these tiny aerosols. You can actually collect aerosols in the air and look and see if infectious viruses there. And indeed that's where that's the only place we've found the infectious virus so far. Um, as you know, the focus has been on, you know, droplets, the big, big droplets. Um, but we're actually, there's far more evidence that it, that it's, that the virus is appearing in these tiny aerosols that remain afloat. Speaker 1: 01:23 Can you give us an example of how the aerosols that contain the virus spread in a room? Speaker 2: 01:28 Sure. Yeah. So basically what happens there is when you speak simply speak, not coughing or sneezing, I mean you can cough and sneeze, but for this virus, it's people don't know they're sick, they have no symptoms. So they're just talking and it's like, it's equivalent, honestly, to being in the room with like a cigarette smoker. And you've been in the room with smokers before you can see the smoke loft into the air and kind of rise and spread out. That's exactly how, uh, these virus aerosols, um, spread about a room. And so if you don't have good ventilation, uh, then they can just build up in a room and the longer you're in the room and the longer you're breathing, the more potentially infectious virus that you're inhaling, Speaker 1: 02:12 Do these aerosols stay in a room even after an infected person leaves. Speaker 2: 02:17 Yes they do. They can hang out in the room for hours. If not days, they just float. They don't sink to the ground, certainly not within six feet. That's the other thing. And so it's super important. Uh, one of the most important factors that you control in a room and not everyone does, this is even if you're six feet apart in a room, you must wear a good fitting mask. Speaker 1: 02:40 Now, after the CDC received the letter that you and 12 other prominent researchers sent last week, the agency did not choose to change its guidelines. It said people are already being advised by the CDC that proper masking is the best defense against infection. What do you think that response is missing? Uh, you know, Speaker 2: 03:01 It was really missed, honestly, that that response sort of missed the bulk of our message. And so we are still in discussions. In fact, I just got done having a discussion on how do we sort of take this to the next level of trying to get them to see that we're really just trying in a lot of ways, just protect workers. They're clearly not being protected well. Um, especially people that work in doors, you know, meat, packing, nursing homes, well, they're starting those, but people that aren't even healthcare like teachers, you know, how do we protect them more? They are not adequately protected right now at all. And so we are not, we're not slowing down, we're waiting for a response from the Biden administration still. Um, and we're trying to figure out sort of the next, um, way to try. And there's many multiple ways you can do this and we're thinking of the next best way to, to try and get this message across our whole goal is just to protect people from indoor exposure. And obviously it's, you know, not enough right now. And so we're continuing to push Speaker 1: 04:02 The letter recommended issuing emergency OSHA workplace requirements on ventilation and air filters. Can you tell us more about that? Speaker 2: 04:11 Yeah. I mean, one of the, uh, I would say almost excuses that's been used, um, unfortunately is that we can't recommend something. They can't recommend something if we don't have enough of them in particular, we there's always, you've heard about the shortage of N 95 masks, the adequate masks since the beginning. And so what we did was we sort of separated the two and we said, okay, you know, make more in 95 masks should include not just the sort of standard ones, but like the, the elastomer respirators, there's all kinds of ways you can, uh, you know, ramp up production. So that's one, and that's more aimed at people in sort of health care, high risk worker situations. And then we said, okay, to take the pressure off the public needs to also have access to good masks. And right now the public can, you can buy a mask, but you don't really know how efficient that mask is. Speaker 2: 05:04 And so we're recommending and there's recommendations that are, I think, going to be coming on, you know, how masks work, how efficient they are at removing the virus, how breathable they are, you know, basically how, how well they fit. These are all things that vary for every mask you buy. So you might be wearing a mask, but that mask may not be effective. Just a tiny leak, just to give you an example, a tiny leak where say it doesn't seal against 1% of your face, right? So just a little hole that can lead to a 50% reduction in filtration efficiency, you know, 2% can lead to like nearly three quarters of a reduction, which means that, you know, 75% more gets through. Right. And so having well-fitting masks, making sure that they fit well and having the public more aware of how to protect themselves is so, so critical right now. And so we were, we sort of split the two because they have different demands and, you know, we're pushing from both directions right now. Speaker 1: 06:03 And what are your recommendations on ventilation and air filters? Speaker 2: 06:07 Yeah, so, you know, ventilation is just the easiest. He can be the easiest one in the sense that, you know, it's cracking a window. Um, if you have a lot of people in doors, reducing the number of people in doors, again, wearing masks and doors is important, but then adding the ventilation, these different layers of protections of ventilation is one. I have been talking a lot more about filtration because these viruses are incredibly filterable. If you will, you can remove them with just a simple HEPA filter, no fancy plasma, ionizer, just a HEPA filter in the room. We'll filter that air and remove the virus from the air that you're breathing. And so, you know, sort of each, each one, we call it a layer of protection, you know, sort of backs you up, you know, and basically gives you more protection. The more you have, Speaker 1: 06:53 So is research indicating that it's not necessary to wipe down surfaces and disinfect packages as so many people have been doing for so long. Speaker 2: 07:01 So far. That's what the research is showing. I mean, it's not saying you should still wash your, you know, you should still wash your hands, but this over cleaning, um, is probably overkill. Uh, the research so far, there's been a couple of really pretty good papers that have shown, you know, relatively little evidence, um, of the transmission via surfaces. It is largely, I mean, all evidence solid evidence we have so far is pointing to inhalation of these tiny aerosols from the air. Speaker 1: 07:29 And so you're still hoping for some positive feedback from the Biden administration. Speaker 2: 07:34 Yeah. You know, I, we haven't gotten any negative. So I think there's just a little bit of a, you know, it was a week ago, I guess. And so, yeah, we're still hoping to hear from the Biden administration, we're going to continue communicating with the CDC who had also went to, we sent it to three different groups. We sent it to the Biden administration. We sent it to Dr. Tony Fowchee and we sent it to the director of the CDC and it was the CDC press office to be specific that responded to the media, not to us. So we still haven't gotten a response from them either. Um, and so we are still, you know, sort of in a holding pattern to some extent, waiting to hear, um, from, you know, one or all of those parties. Speaker 1: 08:17 I've been speaking with UC San Diego, atmospheric chemist, Kim prey there, Kim, thank you very much. Thank you for having me.