Trump Trial Gets More Pointed With Bolton Book At The Center

Speaker 1: 00:00 Today, the impeachment trial of president Trump moves into a new phase now that the president's defense team has ramped up their case. The next couple of days will provide an opportunity for senators to ask their questions of both legal teams and then we'll come the big decision of whether to call witnesses. That question has gained new significant since revelations from former national security advisor, John Bolton leaked and volt and still unreleased book. The former national security advisor says Trump told him he did withhold military aid to Ukraine to get the Ukrainians to investigate Joe Biden. Let's talk about all of it now with former us attorney and you, CSD constitutional law professor and host of the podcast talking feds, Harry Littmann. Harry, welcome. Thanks very much. Good to be here, Jane. So what can we expect to see on the Senate floor today? Speaker 2: 00:50 Well, you know, people have not thought very carefully about this. They said, Oh, we'll have a, you know, they've thought very much at length about the evidentiary presentations and then very much at length about the w the witness battles to come. But this is gonna be something of a food fight. I think you know that Republicans from the start have sought to change the narrative to all kinds of different, um, accusations insinuations about the democratic efforts themselves. So they're going to look to put, uh, Schiff, Adam Schiff at all on trial. That's something you normally can't do. It's not, it's not relevant what a lawyer or prosecutor thinks it's not relevant what the investing [inaudible] was. What's relevant is the facts. On the other hand, it's the Senate, it's impeachment. There's not much, um, in the way of precedent. So it's kind of a wild West. And to make things more complicated, the person who's presiding and is supposed to probably call balls and strikes is John Roberts, who AE hasn't ever been a district court judge and B wants, I'm sure no part of this if he can avoid it, but I don't know if he can, Speaker 1: 02:09 and the senators will have to ask their questions on cards. These cards are anything but high tech. They kind of look like something right out of the 19 are right out of the 17 hundreds rather. Tell me about those. Speaker 2: 02:19 Yes. I mean the poor senators will actually have to write things out, but it doesn't mean that in the normal fashion of things that staff et cetera haven't told them what to say. So there is a quaintness to this uh, ceremony, but a very kind of a, you know, modern day aggressiveness, uh, as well. But that's right. They'll, they'll continue their um, uh, enforced silence. Uh, the questions will be read out by the chief justice. I believe they will identify the questioner though even that wasn't, um, certain. And for those who are always looking for TV moments, you know, to date we haven't seen the senators. I've been fiddling with things and leaving the chambers and the, and the like, it's not clear, um, whether we'll see them even now. Speaker 1: 03:07 Right. The LA times a is out with a story today that says, after saying she would vote against impeachment, California. Senator Dianne Feinstein now says she's undecided. What do you think changed your mind? Speaker 2: 03:18 Well, I'm not sure what she meant in the first place. They, cause the evidence is always seemed overwhelming. So you wouldn't have thought it would have been the evidence in the first place, but rather some kind of, you know, statesman, like, uh, considerations of what's best for the country. Now, why the evidentiary presentation would have changed her mind. I think it would've changed many reasonable minds. Um, it was very, very strong, uh, presentation. But, uh, I don't know what's, what's happened that's new except to Steven's stronger. It's clear through, uh, to the extent maybe she had any kinds of hesitation, uh, centering on say what was Trump's mental state. I think the newest Bolton revelations would have sealed the deal there. So it just might seem overwhelming to me. Um, it, you know, what really comes home and is so sober about this is when you think about the implications and consequences. So what's most I think, troubling about the Republican failure even to engage is w, you know, the, the different aspects of the impeachment, the um, uh, harnessing of public funds for private gain, the political intrigue and probable dishonesty of it and the, um, uh, active efforts to get a foreign power to interfere with an intervene in our own elections. Speaker 1: 04:48 You mentioned John Bolton's revelations, you know, with the reported revelations from the manuscript of former national security advisor, John Bolton's book. Uh, do you think there's enough support among Republican senators to call one or more witnesses at this point? And when do we think they'll take a vote on that? Speaker 2: 05:04 Yeah, yeah. Boy is that nip and tuck and of course McConnell said last night, he doesn't have the votes to prevent it, but of course he's such a master, you know, tactician and parliamentarian. The immediate supposition is, Oh yes he does and he's just taking the heat off the Susan Collins is and Barbara Murkowski is of the, of the world. Uh, I, you know, I think the vote will come after the senatorial presentation. So we're looking at Thursday or Friday. It is really tight. I've gone on record as saying they need three, not 4:00 AM and it may come down to that if I had to guess. Uh, you know, and it's, and it's really I think changing every hour there. But if I had to guess the, uh, I would say that the trend for calling at least a Bolton will be two, two, the tide will be too strong for, for all the Republicans to buck. Uh, I'm thinking it'll be so clear if they don't call them that, you know, Romney in particular and Collins, again, the people who really did it said no witnesses. And how do you face, how do you justify that kind of a decision? But obviously, um, McConnell has pulled many, many an iron out of the fire, uh, before and he's really a master at sort of gently corralling his, um, his folks. So I, you know, I'm not, I'm not betting real money on it. Speaker 1: 06:38 All right. I've been speaking with former us attorney and UCS D constitutional law professor Harry Littmann, also creator and host of the podcast talking feds. Harry, thank you so much for joining us. Thanks for having me. Speaker 3: 06:53 Uh.